True. Matter of opinion I suppose. I just don't believe that anyone of us would go through what Jesus went through. We can sit around, delude, and speculate all we want. It is the moment that counts. Faced with real terror, what course of action would our true natures lead us toward? That's kind of the point to the story......among other lessons........

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Its really as simple as fact vs. faith here. Jesus and everyone else that talked to God in the bible knew of his existence as fact, anyone else that didnt have any personal experience with God was going purely on faith. If I knew for sure as Jesus did that I was going to heaven then sitting on that cross would have been a far easier decision, because there's no doubt in my mind about the consequences.



Its not according to "me", according to the bible. I dont remember a passage that said it was anything other than a great place to be.

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Fear wouldn't keep you from going through the torture even knowing what was on the other side? The pain......the torture......when it would be so easy to turn the other way and disappear? The point is that Jesus did not take the easy way out. There's nothing that says he would have gone to Hell for not sacrificing himself. According to the story, he did what he did so that we could be forgiven for our sins, i.e. shortcomings. I don't really know too many human beings who are as selfless as Jesus was said to be, not even you. You're indicating that you would go through Jesus's torture for your sake not anyone else's. See what I'm saying? To me, your whole reasoning is backwards revealing that you miss the whole point of Jesus and his work in the first place. You're saying that Jesus was just thinking about what was in it for him. Ergo, you wouldn't have a problem going through torture because of what was in it for you. That's kind of off-base..... Jesus did not have any more knowledge of Heaven than anyone else at the time. The only knowledge he had was what was going to happen to him. He knew that he could go forward with that or denounce all the work he had done up until then. God didn't show him a promise of paradise or heavenly endowments. Jesus went through such condemnation for his beliefs and still was able to forgive us before he finally died.

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That's great! I'm saving that one!

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Zero One How dare u say that,,, even though this isnt a holy place or building.. u still should have respect the guy who posted and the guy upstairs.. if u dont your going to hell... say anything bad or disrecptful of God or jesus i consider you a Anti christ supporter... anyway back to the main topic..

if jesus made a sacrifice or hadnt made one what would you think he would do if he saw all this violence and corruption these days? would he be happy or upset? i know id be.

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Originally Posted by sgtclunk Zero One How dare u say that,,, even though this isnt a holy place or building.. u still should have respect the guy who posted and the guy upstairs.. if u dont your going to hell... say anything bad or disrecptful of God or jesus i consider you a Anti christ supporter... anyway back to the main topic..

I'm the anti-Christ. I consider the only good use of the crucifix hammering away at Christian ideals.

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if jesus made a sacrifice or hadnt made one what would you think he would do if he saw all this violence and corruption these days? would he be happy or upset? i know id be.

Violence and corruption? Christendom has corrupted man, it has made virtue into venom, and you are surprised when he finally opens his eye, you do not like the sight? Your determination to find the world ugly, has made the world ugly! If anything is corrupted and vile, it is the Holy See and the other blind churches with their calvinism and protestantism. God is dead. How long will you worship his shadow?

Mr U

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Some Christians may have been too trigger-happy...the KKK, for example, claim to be Christian--it's part of the application (I had a teacher once who downloaded one just to see what they claimed), but look at what they do. It is the people who twist God's Word who corrupt it.

Personally, Jesus' sacrifice did mean something. He was God Incarnate. He could have saved Himself from the Cross and all of the pain associated with Good Friday and the Crucifixion. But He didn't. He said:

Meaning, in Aramaic, "My God, my God, why have You forsaken me?" Forsaken by God...doesn't that mean He would be going to Hell for three days, away from God's presence? Hell is worse pain than anyone could ever imagine. Jesus endured all of that--and you think His sacrifice means nothing?

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Calabunga dude! If jesus is god then why would he call out to himself asking God why he is not protecting him? I know that christiandumb will come up with some hoky lie as to justify that jesus is god despite the evidence that he isn't in their own book of lies, and if somewhere in the bible it says that he is god then the book contadicts itself sense in this part where he is blaming god for allowing him to suffer, it is illogical to a rational person a reasonable person that jesus is god, and thus it is proven that if the bible then turns around in other parts of the book of lies and says he is god then that book is rubbish due to its contadictions- moreover anyone that has read many of my other masterpieces/posts throughout the i-net where I exposed the cruelty of socalled god and many of the contradictions in the bible which by themself prove the bible and its followers to be rubbish to say the least. One then concludes that god is worst than the devil and so are gods followers. Historically who has been the warmongers? Christiandumb right? Who has hated wisdom and truth historically christiandumb right, the same ones that believed the world was flat and killed many who taught it was round or spherical.

Because He had to die in order to create the saving sacrifice. By His blood our sins were forgiven. Note that in Gethsemane, He said "not My will, but Yours be done." Jesus did not want to die, but He knew that His Father's Will was the best way, and He would follow that to the end.


Where did it say He was BLAMING his Father? Show me.


Cruelty? God is a loving God, but He will mete out punishment where necessary. That's what Hell is, by the way: Separation from God and pain for eternity, the price for rejecting Him. That's why we need Jesus because His blood washes our sins clean and, because we are judged sinless because of Him, we are spared from Hell, and go to Heaven instead.

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