Now wait just a damn minute...

Ok. Now let me understand this:

There was a man born inside the matrix who could shape it as he saw fit.

He helped free some of the first people.

What the hell happened to the first people he freed?

1) Muscles atrophy while living in the matrix
2) You are dumped into the big goo puddle and will drown (like neo almost did) unless a big crane like at the bowling alley picks you up like a stuffed animal.
3) There is no sunlight, so no heat, no food, and no clothing
4) Zion is underground

So exactly how did these originally freed shmos not die? The people born outside the matrix have no way of knowing what's going on inside (no one can jack in if no one's ever been freed)

PLOT HOLE!

PLOT HOLE!

The old sewers used to be cities "that stretched for
hundreds of miles". The Matrix is quite old, so the
first ones to be freed might landed in the old cities
before the robots destroyed them.

They make it seem like there were a lot more people
living underground when the Matrix was first
created, so the freed people who arrived there
knowing nothing must have been brought to
health by the humans already living there.

Those are probably the ones who created Zion
after the robots destroyed the sewer cities.

There is no HOLE, There is no SPOON! :D

Originally posted by Rev. Joshua
Ok. Now let me understand this:

There was a man born inside the matrix who could shape it as he saw fit.

He helped free some of the first people.

What the hell happened to the first people he freed?

1) Muscles atrophy while living in the matrix
2) You are dumped into the big goo puddle and will drown (like neo almost did) unless a big crane like at the bowling alley picks you up like a stuffed animal.
3) There is no sunlight, so no heat, no food, and no clothing
4) Zion is underground

So exactly how did these originally freed shmos not die? The people born outside the matrix have no way of knowing what's going on inside (no one can jack in if no one's ever been freed)

PLOT HOLE!


Actually your completely wrong here..

According to some fictions I've read (official sources) that the Human race didn't actually die, it went underground because of all the nukes, and after that the AI composed the Matrix, and forced the human body into it.

I believe that when the AI forced a human body onto the matrix they initially made it, that ONE body, who was the "test" subject, for the matrix, told the outside world what was happening and told people to prep for it, hence they made machines to host people from the goo, and do things such

The hole has been closed.

The only thing I wonder about, is how the machines got
the first humans into the Matrix.

They'd have to drill holes in their brains, hands, legs, etc.

I experimented with Virtual Reality simulations/worlds a while
back when the stuff was still popular and I always wondered
how we could fully interact inside an aritifical world. The only
way I could think of is to come up with a device that is capable
of reading and transmitting electronic signals to the brain,
something like a hat-look-a-like.

The new games have such high detail, that if we found
some way to actually exist in the game instead of in front
of a monitor, it would bring on a whole new level of
not only gaming, but life. People would be able to
do everything from business to go ingto Church (Rev. Joshua)
and everything else.

Once again, the only problem here is we have no way of
hooking up a human subject to a machine without messing
around with the brain.

Luc L.

If we were able to get a human brain hooked up to a system that could interperate such things would the brain then evlolve to become dependant apon the system?

And what about the movements of man? If we stuffed them into those little tanks with no exersize then how could bodies be different as in fatter, thinner, taller, shorter?

I guess the brain would continue to evolve at the regular
rate, except it would think that it exists in the Matrix, when
it really existed in a tube.

As far as the other question, I'm not sure how they would stuff
people into these tubes.

Luc L.

My take on the matter would be that maybe there was a lot of research already done on the matter of merging machine and human with bionics and such. The year is about 200 years in the future, I would think that technology in 200 years would be pretty advanced. The AI wouldn't have to start their research from scratch.

-WC-

well u never know the ai was supose to be an advance thing so they sould have had the knowledge to do so with no problem can;t wiat for new movie

I believe that when the AI forced a human body onto the matrix they initially made it, that ONE body, who was the "test" subject, for the matrix, told the outside world what was happening and told people to prep for it, hence they made machines to host people from the goo, and do things such

I don't follow you. You're saying that the 1st person in the matrix told the rest of the world what's going down?

Originally posted by Rev. Joshua
I don't follow you. You're saying that the 1st person in the matrix told the rest of the world what's going down?


Basically yes.

Think about it, the AI developed a "demo" of sorts of the matrix to make humas happy, and then turned it on them.

The beta tester of the demo told everyone about what was going down with the superfical demo.. because at that time they didn't have the "pods" that Neo was born into..

and over time the machines just refined the demo and made it flawless enough that people eventually thought it was a reality.


And then, well, the machines took over, and forced everyone into this virtual world of sorts, and of course, there were a few survivors of the "great forcing."

It wouldn't have to have been something they betatested at all. It might have been that these sort of brain plugins were mainstream - maybe people plugged in to surf the web or for virtual reality entertainment.

Once AI went evil, it would be as simple as taking people, babies, etc and throwing them into pods. Then growing the next generation.

If you think this is not plausible, I want you to think about the level of technology advancement that has happened globally in the past 200 years. Heck, it was only 225ish years ago that the US signed its independence from Britian. They fought each other with muskets.

-WC-

the humans in the goo pluged in are exacly like a processer in a computer,it doesn't know its in a comp. but it thinks its somewhere else.

I think any plot hole that has to be explained using beta testing is way too complicated.

1. Zion may be in the matrix.

2. Zion may have been built by the machines as part of the mother's scheme to boost matrix acceptance levels up to 99%.

3. Zion may have been populated since the prematrix era. It is afterall supposedly the last human city. Maybe it has always had a population of at least 23.

Josh.

The "first people freed" were probably freed with the help of the machines and the Neo v1.0. At least, that is what the Architect would have us believe.

For that to work, the first "current" version of the Matrix (the versions that contain the "anomaly") must have been created with some initial humans already "free" and in Zion, again probably with the help of the AI machines, so that they could "find" the One and fulfill the role of the anomaly.

Originally posted by josh w
I think any plot hole that has to be explained using beta testing is way too complicated.

1. Zion may be in the matrix.

2. Zion may have been built by the machines as part of the mother's scheme to boost matrix acceptance levels up to 99%.

3. Zion may have been populated since the prematrix era. It is afterall supposedly the last human city. Maybe it has always had a population of at least 23.

Josh.

1. There is no matrix inside a matrix, therefore Zion is not in a matrix.

2. Zion was not built by the machines. The mother engineered the current version of the matrix. Only 99% of the people accepted it. The other 1% is Zion or the people that reject the program. We KNOW this because as soon as the Architect mentioned the other 1%, Neo says right away, "This is about Zion, isn't it?"

3. After The One reaches the source, he is allowed to pick 23 people to rebuild Zion once it is destroyed by 250,000 squiddies. That is why Morpheus said, "It was him who freed the first of us." It was actually Anomaly Version 5.0 picking 23 people to exit the matrix with him to rebuild Zion. Yes, you are partly right on this one: Zion has always been populated by at least 23 people.

Originally posted by trinityflame_fv
If we were able to get a human brain hooked up to a system that could interperate such things would the brain then evlolve to become dependant apon the system?

And what about the movements of man? If we stuffed them into those little tanks with no exersize then how could bodies be different as in fatter, thinner, taller, shorter?

"...watch them liquify the dead to be fed intrevenously to the living..."

I belive the machines use nutritional supply to control our physical shape.

For example, if someone (let's say an anorexic) is starving herself (I use a female example purposely) in the matrix, then the machine probably pump less nutrition into her. They control her food levels according to what she eats (or does not eat) in the matrix. So if she dies of starvation in the matrix, she actually does die of starvation.

Also to address your exercise question, they probably offer the humans less food so they get less fat. Only when they get fatter in the matrix to the machines pump in enough food to make them as fat as they are in their minds.

I´m sorry if I´m going way back on this thread but is it proven that people were forced into the matrix. I always had the impression that only the grown humans got plugged. Those alive when the matrix was completed either got exterminated or fled to Zion. Only the grown humans have the plugs in their body. That´s my point on the subject.

WOW, my friend and I were talking about this like a week ago, before this thread... lol... We were thinking that you would have to record all brain waves that a person would be emitting (like, move the arm up = this brain wave) Hook up those alpha brain sensors and see exactly what they are doing. For the part where the person would move too much, we would have to put them into a dream-like state of mine... Where their brains would still function as if they are moving, but the body will not. We would hook those people up to a mainframe computer controlled by another human that would only make sure that things don't go wronge and watch over everything. We were actually going on about this when playing DnD (Dungeons and Dragons) If you think of it, an invention like that (after all the hard work in recording the brain waves) would corner the market on all new games. Imagine a game where you are actually in it and play like that. (I WANT!!!)

Well, about the Zion thing. I think Zion existed before the matrix, the last human city... so de original Zionists didn't have those plugs etc.

When the Matrix was first build it was perfect. But that was a big mistake of the Architect because Lots of people died because they didn't accept the program. Then an intuitive program (the oracle) discovered that humans needed a choice no matter how unconscious people are. 99% of mankind accepted this Matrix but 1% didn't because of an anomaly. To take this anomaly out the architect made another Matrix like program: Zion. This is where the 1% got dumped who didn't accept the Matrix. Now the architect is finding out how to get rid of this anomaly so that he can write the perfect Matrix where no man will rebel against it and everyone becomes a slave.